Open Air Microphone Septup and Satisfaction Survery

[shaurya]

Hello,

I would like to know how satisfied everyone is if they have implemented Open Air Microphone for Voice Recognition.

I would also like to know what setup has worked best so far. Please post the hardware (model no) and setup details if possible.

So far I understood that use of Crown PMZ-11 microphone and Getner AP800 Mixer has provided the optimal configuration. I think Paul (pkoslow) has the most extensive, tried & tested setup and I am taking step by step (baby steps) to acheive the same to some extent.

Thanks,
Shaurya

[pkoslow]

Shaurya,

You're familiar with my configuration so I won't detail it here (if others are interested, check the web link below in my signature).

I feel that I've got VR working as well as the existing technology will allow. The mics placed around the house with the control of the AP800 mixer give me voice control from everywhere except the guest bath & guest bedroom (by design). With proper mic placement and lots of tuning (trial and error) I can now issue commands in a normal voice from anywhere else in the house with very good results.

The following problems still exist with my setup:

1. Outside noise: Here in California, we have the house open much of the time and noise from barking dogs, and loud cars/motorcycles can still disrupt VR. This doesn't happen often, but the neighbors dog or a Harley rolling by while you're issueing a VR command will disrupt things.
   
   We live on a corner and with the doors/windows open a loud car will gate on the mics as it travels past the front of the house and around the corner. If I watch the mic gate status on the Genter AP800 mixer as this happens, I'll see the office mic gate on , then the dinning room, then the bedroom, then the living room.
   
   Again, this isn't too big of a deal and if you live in an area with well insulated homes and have them clsoed up most of the time (and don't live on a corner) it is probably a non-issue. I plan to install a Crown PZM-11LLWR mic which is outdoor rated under the front eave of the house and run it into the AP800 where I can use it's signal to help eliminate the outdoor noises from VR... this will probably correct much of the problem.
2. Other people in the house:This one is a fact of life, and I don't think any technology will ever be available to overcome this in an open air mic installation. Back when I was single (and now if I'm home alone), this isn't a problem and VR reliability is awesome. If you have others in the house, this can become a problem and only escalates the issue with the more people you have around.
   
   I can't tell you how many times I have issued a voice command from one room at the same time my girlfriend starts talking to the cat, talking on the phone, or creating other noises with doors/cabinets. This usually doesn't cause a false trigger, but does require you to repeat the command. With the AP800 you can set certain mics to be "Chairman" which allows them to override "Non-Chairman" mics and also set the system to only allow one mic to gate on at a time... all this helps, but can only do so much.
   
   
   Both of the above conditions can cause problems with HomeSeer knowing which room you are in. In my setup, the mic gate status updates a virtual device so HS knows where you are speaking from. If I'm in the office and say "lights on" about the same time my girlfriend shuts a cabinet or runs water in the kitchen, sometimes the response from tts is "kitchen lights on" and the lights go on there instead of the office where I am.
   
   Outside noise can cause similar problems if you say "ceiling fan on" in the bedroom and the neighbors dog barks, maybe the fan in the living room will come on? Again, I think the outside microphone will help overcome this issue which is actually rarely a problem.

In summary... I'm being very critical here and feel that open air VR can be reliable. It does require a bunch of time and some investment to get it right, but for me the challenge was a big part of the lure. In reality, I've probably spent as much time with the VR install as I have with all my other HA projects put together! I do use it, and it does work well... but I probably only issue 2-3 VR commands each day and sometimes will go for a day or two without even using it.

Now with the RFID so many things happen automatically that I mostly use VR just for added convienence.

Cheers,
Paul

[jrfuda]

I have 3 PA3's, two of which I had setup before I moved. They worked OK, but I turned them off becuase 75% reliablility translates into low WAF.

I am now in a new home and have a faster PC running HomeSeer, but have not gotten around to re-implementing VR.

[MBenzo]

I also was using some PA3's. They worked fine in a quiet environment, but background noise wreaked havoc on them. So I have diisabled because of low WAF. Right now I don't have the time or money to do it right, and I am waiting for 2.0 for the distributed VR capabilities.

Matt

[londajm]

My Survey Response

I continue to develop TTS and SR Technology, and the overall human to computer interface, as our children are more likely to use it and be satisfied with it. In the current day, we can only consider ourself explorers. Set your expecatations in line with this, but don't discourage, every field of exploration needs a person willing to pursue what could be posssible expecting that they will become the "Edison" of it.

[DanWheeler]

I have 3 PA3 mics around the house. 1 in a very large room with no furniture that works OK. Another in my bedroom and another in my office. I run them all into a cheap Behringer 8 channel mixer then into the sound blaster. Even though it really frustrates me sometimes I think it's a totally amazing system and is more than just a toy. It's actually very useful.

noise is definitely a problem. Washing machines, fans, wind, cars etc really wreak havoc on reliability.

[gcyeaw]

I now have two PZM-11 mikes and a Biamp mixer with an Advantage AGII Priority Gate. (Paul Koslowski's previous equipment). I live in the North East and now (as of 3 weeks ago) have central air, so the windows and doors are closed. I am still tuning the setup, but as expected, with three or four people living in the house there are lots of extraneous noises to confuse the VR software and gate different mikes on.

Previously I used a portable phone with excellent results, so I am certain the VR software is pretty good. Open-air mikes really need a much more sophisticated system than just a plain mixer and sound card. I tend to think that a single system needs to be dedicated to VR with hardware and software specifically designed for that purpose. Once the system is able to recognize a particular voice, it will become immensely more useful.

In the meantime, the environment is the key to success. A single person or at least one with tolerant housemates can have reasonable success. For the rest of us, we can only enjoy the fruits of our labor when everyone sits very still and shuts up.

This is only my opinion, I could be wrong.

Gardner

[Rupp]

I now have two PZM-11 mikes and a Biamp mixer with an Advantage AGII Priority Gate. (Paul Koslowski's previous equipment). I live in the North East and now (as of 3 weeks ago) have central air, so the windows and doors are closed. I am still tuning the setup, but as expected, with three or four people living in the house there are lots of extraneous noises to confuse the VR software and gate different mikes on.

Previously I used a portable phone with excellent results, so I am certain the VR software is pretty good. Open-air mikes really need a much more sophisticated system than just a plain mixer and sound card. I tend to think that a single system needs to be dedicated to VR with hardware and software specifically designed for that purpose. Once the system is able to recognize a particular voice, it will become immensely more useful.

In the meantime, the environment is the key to success. A single person or at least one with tolerant housemates can have reasonable success. For the rest of us, we can only enjoy the fruits of our labor when everyone sits very still and shuts up.

This is only my opinion, I could be wrong.

Gardner

If you don't mind me asking how much was your VR setup. I'm try to decide if it's worth getting into even at a low to medium success rate.

[gcyeaw]

Rupp,
In round figures, the mikes were $80 each and the mixer and Gateing adapter were used, about $80 if I remember. So I have $240 into it without mike wire, which is stuff I already had. The mixer and priority gate (Advantage 801 mixer and Advantage AGII priority gate ) can often be found on e-bay at a reasonable price, or better yet, look at Steve's current equipment and check the e-bay prices for that. The noise cancelation ability of Steves latest aquisitions is very interesting.

I still maintain that if you use a portable phone you will be very pleased and the investment will be minimal. I don't really expect the open-air mikes to be of much real value until my last kid goes off to college, then the house may be quiet enough to have better success. The system currently triggers various events based on random noise, and that isn't a good thing.

The main reason I am currently working with open-air mikes is that we did a major renovation and I had the oportunity to run lots of wire for future use, and now that it is in, I have an uncontrolable urge to do something with it.

[Rupp]

Rupp,
In round figures, the mikes were $80 each and the mixer and Gateing adapter were used, about $80 if I remember. So I have $240 into it without mike wire, which is stuff I already had. The mixer and priority gate (Advantage 801 mixer and Advantage AGII priority gate ) can often be found on e-bay at a reasonable price, or better yet, look at Steve's current equipment and check the e-bay prices for that. The noise cancelation ability of Steves latest aquisitions is very interesting.

I still maintain that if you use a portable phone you will be very pleased and the investment will be minimal. I don't really expect the open-air mikes to be of much real value until my last kid goes off to college, then the house may be quiet enough to have better success. The system currently triggers various events based on random noise, and that isn't a good thing.

The main reason I am currently working with open-air mikes is that we did a major renovation and I had the oportunity to run lots of wire for future use, and now that it is in, I have an uncontrolable urge to do something with it.

WOW that was't near as bad as I tought. I knew what the mics costs I just was curious what the mixer and gater cost. To tell you the truth I'm not even sure what a gater is used for? I assume the mixer is used to allow the use of mutiple inputs/mics?

[CaymanIslandCarpediem]

WOW that was't near as bad as I tought. I knew what the mics costs I just was curious what the mixer and gater cost. To tell you the truth I'm not even sure what a gater is used for? I assume the mixer is used to allow the use of mutiple inputs/mics?

I'm also trying what Pual has I believe Paul is now using the Gentner AP800 (does both the mixing and gating. They can also be found on Ebay. I waited around for a bit and picked one up for $100. Here is the one I got. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...MEWN%3AIT&rd=1

Gating basically just means a certain level of sound is required before it would be forwarded to the sound card for VR. This can be set very sensitve so basically any noise will trigger the gating and it will be forwarded to VR or you can set it very high so you have to speak VERY loudly before it will trigger VR. This is VERY usefull (if you can find the proper settings) so help the system ignore ambient noise (AC, TV in background, etc).

[shaurya]

I am glad to see that some of the most expereinced people participating this thread and sharing the experience and setup. PZM-11 Mic with Gentner AP800 Mixer seems to be be the way to go. Paul appears to be the only one masterd the art with 90% success rate.

I noticed "geroge" polled for upto 80% satisfaction. I am requesting "george" to share his setup with model details helping us capitalize on his expertise.

"george" where are you? Please share your secret!!!

[glt]

shaurya,

I've seen your post on VR in that *other* HA software forum. You should know about the problems with tosexe.exe and ASRLHMic.exe on their software. It will freeze your computer sometimes. Their tech support recommended that I turn off mic based VR and only use the phones. Not much of a solution! It is a problem for many and has been their "number one priority" for YEARS.

Speaker independant VR is just untrained VR and is available in HS. However with my voice (hardly Dan Rather) it won't work at all.

I use 900 MHZ intercoms with motion detectors and appliance modules to follow me around. See my other posts. I would say about 80% satisfied because wireless systems can be problematic. Also I'm the only one here, a big advantage for VR and HA, if not for other more important things.

Good luck,

GLT

P.S. You man want to look here (one of many)
http://www.automatedliving.com/phpbb...51c91b7eac1e05

[shaurya]

Yes 'glt'

I read that post. This is one of the reason I am unable to decide which band to join down the line.

Shaurya

[kevinsul]

Glt - more info on VR/Speaker setup?

GLT,

Hello - I have read several posts from you about how you use 900Mhz intercom (RS versions I believe) as well as wireless speakers to accomplish VR and speaker distribution for HS... Can you send me more detail on how you have this setup exactly/how well it works?

I have read in your posts bits and pieces but just want to make sure I understand the setup completely - maybe there is a post you can point me to with this info?

Thanks!

Kevin